I’ve only read the Bible a bit but I don’t recall Jesus actually condeming anyone to an eternity of agony and torment. Didn’t that fire and brimstone stuff come from others who actually wrote the parts of the Bible?

The parable of the Good Samaritan?

And are you sure there are no stories involving Jesus and the Sea of Galilee? I don’t claim to be an expert, and I’m sure you did your homework, but I have this nagging suspicion that it shows up once or twice.

Lastly, if *I* were the Son of God, I’d probably end up sounding like a religious fanatic, too – what with having the inside track on the truth and all, and being faced with you short-sighted cretins trading off 70 years of cheap thrills for an eternity lost. If I were more good natured than I am, I might even try to persuade you out of kindness.

Doesn’t it all really boil down to whether it is true or not?

I don’t happen to think so, but I also don’t happen to think specious arguments like this advance the cause very much.

On the other hand, Bob’s warning to David is well taken. The non-canonical gospels of Jesus’s youth portray pretty much what you’d expect if you gave any 5-year old omnipotence.

The syncretics and people out for a chance at power who created the Jesus character did not do careful work.

Perhaps a more constructive approach would be to first of all, study all the writings that mention Jesus (including those not contained in the Bible), and try to understand them in their proper historical context. Then, read about the history of the Church, in order to understand the role they played in creating Jesus as the official Son Of God, and themselves as the earthly conduit to Him, thereby powerfully subverting people’s freedom of thought.

Finally, have many discussions about what causes people in modern times to blindly accept religious superstition, and even murder in order to honor those superstitions.

I agree that there’s not much to find favorable with religion, and it’s interesting to speculate that Jesus and religion serve as the fatherly caretaker of one’s soul, even if that father is abusive. Demonizing Jesus, however, will only serve to galvanize the paranoia of the superstitious.

1. God is All Knowing…..but Jesus was not
When speaking of the day of judgment, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a
limitation on his knowledge when he said, “but of that day and hour
knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the
son, but the Father.” Mark 13:32, and Matt 24:36. But God knows all.
His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own
admission, did not know when the day of judgment would be, is clear
proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not
God.

2. God is All Powerful…..but Jesus was not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the
power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said,
“Verily, verily I say unto you, the Son can do nothing of himself, but
what he seeth the Father do…” St. John 5:19. Again he said, “I can of
mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgment is just;
because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which
hath sent me.” St. John 5:30. But God is not only all-powerful, He is
also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his own
admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus is
not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.

3. God does not have a God…..but Jesus did have a God.
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call
upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was one
whom he worshipped and to whom he prayed when he said, “l ascend unto
my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God.” St. John
20:17. He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, “My
God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?” Matt 27:46. If Jesus were God,
then couldn’t this be read, “Myself, myself why hast thou forsaken
me?” Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord’s
prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of
Gethsemane he prayed, “O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup
pass from me: Nevertheless not as I will but as thou wilt.” Matt
26:36-39. Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own
admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed
to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.

4. God is an invisible spirit…..but Jesus was flesh and blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that
this could not be done with God when he said. “No man hath seen God at
any time.” St. John 1:18. ‘”Ye have neither heard His voice at any
time nor seen His shape.” St. John 5:37. He also said in St. John
4:24. “God is a spirit and they that worship him must worship him in
spirit and in truth.” That Jesus would say that no one had seen or
heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is
clear proof that Jesus was not God.

5. No one is greater than God and no one can direct Him but Jesus
acknowledged someone greater than himself whose will was distinct from
his own.
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not
equal, and therefore not one and the same, come again from the mouth
of Jesus himself who said in St. John 14:28, “My Father is greater
than I.” When someone referred to him as good master in Matt 19:17,
Jesus responded, “Why callest thou me good? There is none good but
one, that is God…” Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions between
himself and God when he said, “I proceeded forth and came from God,
neither came I of myself but He sent me.” St. John 8:42. Jesus gave
clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his equality
with God,when he said in Luke 22:42, “not my will but thine be done”
and in St. John 5:30, “I seek not mine own will but the will of the
Father which hath sent me.” That Jesus would admit that he did not
come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do so,
that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself, and
that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the will
of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One and
therefore Jesus is not God.

Let see the warning by Jesus
Mark 7:6-13 (New King James Version)

6 He answered and said to them, “Well did Isaiah prophesy of you
hypocrites, as it is written:

‘ This people honors Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
7 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’[a]

8 For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of
men[b]—the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things
you do.”
9 He said to them, “All too well you reject the commandment of God,
that you may keep your tradition.

10 For Moses said, ‘Honor your
father and your mother’;[c] and, ‘He who curses father or mother, let
him be put to death.’[d] 11 But you say, ‘If a man says to his father
or mother, “Whatever profit you might have received from me is
Corban”—’ (that is, a gift to God), 12 then you no longer let him do
anything for his father or his mother, 13 making the word of God of no
effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many
such things you do.”

May Almighty God the Creator bless every one of us who seek the truth.

AMEN